From rjm at swift.eng.ox.ac.uk Wed Mar 20 20:16:10 1996 From: rjm at swift.eng.ox.ac.uk (Bob Manners) Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 10:16:10 +0000 (GMT) Subject: UNIX for 11/23 Message-ID: Having met with storming success (thanks Warren) in getting UNIX v6 and v7 up and running on my 11/34, and having recently (well yesterday) acquired an 11/23+, I'd like to put UNIX on the latter. Now, the 11/23 has 128Kw, a 10Mb RD51 winchester and an RX50 floppy. I need to get hold of a version of UNIX (pref. v7) The UNIX in question obviously needs to support the RD51. In the case of the 11/34 I built a UNIX image under a PDP-11 emulator and KERMITed it to the 11/34. I plan to do the same in this case ... Any suggestions welcome. Does v7 support RD series drives? If not, what does? Cheers, Bob. -- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Robert Manners Osney Laboratory rjm at swift.eng.ox.ac.uk Dept of Engineering Science University of Oxford 01865 288762 Computer Museum: http://swift.eng.ox.ac.uk/rjm/museum.html Also: http://swift.eng.ox.ac.uk "The comfort you've demanded is now mandatory" - Jello Biafra ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- From wkt at dolphin.cs.adfa.oz.au Thu Mar 21 09:23:49 1996 From: wkt at dolphin.cs.adfa.oz.au (Warren Toomey) Date: Thu, 21 Mar 1996 09:23:49 +1000 (EST) Subject: UNIX for 11/23 In-Reply-To: from "Bob Manners" at Mar 20, 96 10:16:10 am Message-ID: <9603202323.AA23006@dolphin> In atricle by Bob Manners: > > Now, the 11/23 has 128Kw, a 10Mb RD51 winchester and an RX50 floppy. I > need to get hold of a version of UNIX (pref. v7) The UNIX in question > obviously needs to support the RD51. > > Does v7 support RD series drives? If not, what does? v7 doesn't support RDs (just looked thru the archive), and I don't know of anything that does. You'd probably have to write your own device driver :-( Warren From sms at wlv.iipo.gtegsc.com Thu Mar 21 08:39:32 1996 From: sms at wlv.iipo.gtegsc.com (Steven M. Schultz) Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 14:39:32 -0800 (PST) Subject: UNIX for 11/23 Message-ID: <199603202239.OAA28894@wlv.iipo.gtegsc.com> Hi - > From: wkt at dolphin.cs.adfa.oz.au (Warren Toomey) > In article by Bob Manners: > > > > Does v7 support RD series drives? If not, what does? > > v7 doesn't support RDs (just looked thru the archive), and I don't know > of anything that does. You'd probably have to write your own device driver :-( > Warren Warren's correct. MSCP support did not enter the 'BSD' picture until late 2.9BSD or early 2.10BSD. TMSCP support for tapes didn't come about until early 2.11BSD when I "borrowed" the driver from 4.3BSD (who had earlier borrowed it from Ultrix). It should be noted that the MSCP (and to a greater degree TMSCP) is a *pig* - it's the largest driver in the system, rivaling the TTY subsystem sizewise. An 11/23 is already extremely cramped for address space even using simpler/smaller drivers such as the RK, RL, etc. I seriously doubt the MSCP driver could be smashed in to a 11/23 kernel and leave room for too much else. Steven Schultz sms at wlv.iipo.gtegsc.com From rjm at swift.eng.ox.ac.uk Thu Mar 21 19:44:37 1996 From: rjm at swift.eng.ox.ac.uk (Bob Manners) Date: Thu, 21 Mar 1996 09:44:37 +0000 (GMT) Subject: UNIX for 11/23 (fwd) Message-ID: Forwarded message: Subject: Re: UNIX for 11/23 To: wkt at csadfa.cs.adfa.oz.au (Warren Toomey) Date: Thu, 21 Mar 1996 09:40:12 +0000 (GMT) In-Reply-To: <9603202323.AA23006 at dolphin> from "Warren Toomey" at Mar 21, 96 09:23:49 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text > >In atricle by Bob Manners: >> >> Now, the 11/23 has 128Kw, a 10Mb RD51 winchester and an RX50 floppy. I >> need to get hold of a version of UNIX (pref. v7) The UNIX in question >> obviously needs to support the RD51. >> >> Does v7 support RD series drives? If not, what does? > >v7 doesn't support RDs (just looked thru the archive), and I don't know >of anything that does. You'd probably have to write your own device driver :-( I beleive Digital's MV7 (I think) does support RDs. It is mentioned in the 11/23+ Owners Manual. I'll have to check. I guess this version isn't in the archive ... Cheers, Bob. -- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Robert Manners Osney Laboratory rjm at swift.eng.ox.ac.uk Dept of Engineering Science University of Oxford 01865 288762 Computer Museum: http://swift.eng.ox.ac.uk/rjm/museum.html Also: http://swift.eng.ox.ac.uk "The comfort you've demanded is now mandatory" - Jello Biafra ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Robert Manners Osney Laboratory rjm at swift.eng.ox.ac.uk Dept of Engineering Science University of Oxford 01865 288762 Computer Museum: http://swift.eng.ox.ac.uk/rjm/museum.html Also: http://swift.eng.ox.ac.uk "The comfort you've demanded is now mandatory" - Jello Biafra ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- From rjm at swift.eng.ox.ac.uk Thu Mar 21 19:44:25 1996 From: rjm at swift.eng.ox.ac.uk (Bob Manners) Date: Thu, 21 Mar 1996 09:44:25 +0000 (GMT) Subject: UNIX for 11/23 (fwd) Message-ID: Forwarded message: Subject: Re: UNIX for 11/23 To: sms at wlv.iipo.gtegsc.com (Steven M. Schultz) Date: Thu, 21 Mar 1996 09:43:47 +0000 (GMT) In-Reply-To: <199603202239.OAA28894 at wlv.iipo.gtegsc.com> from "Steven M. Schultz" at Mar 20, 96 02:39:32 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text What about Digital's MV7 (or whatever it was called). This is mentioned in the 11/23+ owners' manual as supported. Thus it must run on the 11/23+ and support RD series disks. It is basically Bell Labs version 7 I think. > Warren's correct. MSCP support did not enter the 'BSD' picture until > late 2.9BSD or early 2.10BSD. TMSCP support for tapes didn't come > about until early 2.11BSD when I "borrowed" the driver from 4.3BSD > (who had earlier borrowed it from Ultrix). OK. I guess 2.x BSD (x>=9) requires separate I+D space? That would rule out the 11/23+ I think. > It should be noted that the MSCP (and to a greater degree TMSCP) > is a *pig* - it's the largest driver in the system, rivaling the > TTY subsystem sizewise. Yes. I can believe that. Looks like writing my own driver would be no fun at all! > An 11/23 is already extremely cramped for address space even using > simpler/smaller drivers such as the RK, RL, etc. I seriously doubt > the MSCP driver could be smashed in to a 11/23 kernel and leave room > for too much else. The 11/23+ has plenty of address space (22 bit), but mine only has 128Kw ... Cheers, Bob. -- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Robert Manners Osney Laboratory rjm at swift.eng.ox.ac.uk Dept of Engineering Science University of Oxford 01865 288762 Computer Museum: http://swift.eng.ox.ac.uk/rjm/museum.html Also: http://swift.eng.ox.ac.uk "The comfort you've demanded is now mandatory" - Jello Biafra ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Robert Manners Osney Laboratory rjm at swift.eng.ox.ac.uk Dept of Engineering Science University of Oxford 01865 288762 Computer Museum: http://swift.eng.ox.ac.uk/rjm/museum.html Also: http://swift.eng.ox.ac.uk "The comfort you've demanded is now mandatory" - Jello Biafra ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- From sms at wlv.iipo.gtegsc.com Fri Mar 22 02:31:20 1996 From: sms at wlv.iipo.gtegsc.com (Steven M. Schultz) Date: Thu, 21 Mar 1996 08:31:20 -0800 (PST) Subject: UNIX for 11/23 (fwd) Message-ID: <199603211631.IAA19050@wlv.iipo.gtegsc.com> Robert - > I beleive Digital's MV7 (I think) does support RDs. It is mentioned in > the 11/23+ Owners Manual. I'll have to check. I guess this version > isn't in the archive ... True - Ultrix-11 (what MV7 was called later on) does have MSCP support in it. I've not looked at how they handle the rather prodigious data space requirements (~2kb per controller) yet. Cheers. Steven From rjm at swift.eng.ox.ac.uk Wed Mar 20 20:16:10 1996 From: rjm at swift.eng.ox.ac.uk (Bob Manners) Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 10:16:10 +0000 (GMT) Subject: UNIX for 11/23 Message-ID: Having met with storming success (thanks Warren) in getting UNIX v6 and v7 up and running on my 11/34, and having recently (well yesterday) acquired an 11/23+, I'd like to put UNIX on the latter. Now, the 11/23 has 128Kw, a 10Mb RD51 winchester and an RX50 floppy. I need to get hold of a version of UNIX (pref. v7) The UNIX in question obviously needs to support the RD51. In the case of the 11/34 I built a UNIX image under a PDP-11 emulator and KERMITed it to the 11/34. I plan to do the same in this case ... Any suggestions welcome. Does v7 support RD series drives? If not, what does? Cheers, Bob. -- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Robert Manners Osney Laboratory rjm at swift.eng.ox.ac.uk Dept of Engineering Science University of Oxford 01865 288762 Computer Museum: http://swift.eng.ox.ac.uk/rjm/museum.html Also: http://swift.eng.ox.ac.uk "The comfort you've demanded is now mandatory" - Jello Biafra ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- From wkt at dolphin.cs.adfa.oz.au Thu Mar 21 09:23:49 1996 From: wkt at dolphin.cs.adfa.oz.au (Warren Toomey) Date: Thu, 21 Mar 1996 09:23:49 +1000 (EST) Subject: UNIX for 11/23 In-Reply-To: from "Bob Manners" at Mar 20, 96 10:16:10 am Message-ID: <9603202323.AA23006@dolphin> In atricle by Bob Manners: > > Now, the 11/23 has 128Kw, a 10Mb RD51 winchester and an RX50 floppy. I > need to get hold of a version of UNIX (pref. v7) The UNIX in question > obviously needs to support the RD51. > > Does v7 support RD series drives? If not, what does? v7 doesn't support RDs (just looked thru the archive), and I don't know of anything that does. You'd probably have to write your own device driver :-( Warren From sms at wlv.iipo.gtegsc.com Thu Mar 21 08:39:32 1996 From: sms at wlv.iipo.gtegsc.com (Steven M. Schultz) Date: Wed, 20 Mar 1996 14:39:32 -0800 (PST) Subject: UNIX for 11/23 Message-ID: <199603202239.OAA28894@wlv.iipo.gtegsc.com> Hi - > From: wkt at dolphin.cs.adfa.oz.au (Warren Toomey) > In article by Bob Manners: > > > > Does v7 support RD series drives? If not, what does? > > v7 doesn't support RDs (just looked thru the archive), and I don't know > of anything that does. You'd probably have to write your own device driver :-( > Warren Warren's correct. MSCP support did not enter the 'BSD' picture until late 2.9BSD or early 2.10BSD. TMSCP support for tapes didn't come about until early 2.11BSD when I "borrowed" the driver from 4.3BSD (who had earlier borrowed it from Ultrix). It should be noted that the MSCP (and to a greater degree TMSCP) is a *pig* - it's the largest driver in the system, rivaling the TTY subsystem sizewise. An 11/23 is already extremely cramped for address space even using simpler/smaller drivers such as the RK, RL, etc. I seriously doubt the MSCP driver could be smashed in to a 11/23 kernel and leave room for too much else. Steven Schultz sms at wlv.iipo.gtegsc.com From rjm at swift.eng.ox.ac.uk Thu Mar 21 19:44:37 1996 From: rjm at swift.eng.ox.ac.uk (Bob Manners) Date: Thu, 21 Mar 1996 09:44:37 +0000 (GMT) Subject: UNIX for 11/23 (fwd) Message-ID: Forwarded message: Subject: Re: UNIX for 11/23 To: wkt at csadfa.cs.adfa.oz.au (Warren Toomey) Date: Thu, 21 Mar 1996 09:40:12 +0000 (GMT) In-Reply-To: <9603202323.AA23006 at dolphin> from "Warren Toomey" at Mar 21, 96 09:23:49 am X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text > >In atricle by Bob Manners: >> >> Now, the 11/23 has 128Kw, a 10Mb RD51 winchester and an RX50 floppy. I >> need to get hold of a version of UNIX (pref. v7) The UNIX in question >> obviously needs to support the RD51. >> >> Does v7 support RD series drives? If not, what does? > >v7 doesn't support RDs (just looked thru the archive), and I don't know >of anything that does. You'd probably have to write your own device driver :-( I beleive Digital's MV7 (I think) does support RDs. It is mentioned in the 11/23+ Owners Manual. I'll have to check. I guess this version isn't in the archive ... Cheers, Bob. -- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Robert Manners Osney Laboratory rjm at swift.eng.ox.ac.uk Dept of Engineering Science University of Oxford 01865 288762 Computer Museum: http://swift.eng.ox.ac.uk/rjm/museum.html Also: http://swift.eng.ox.ac.uk "The comfort you've demanded is now mandatory" - Jello Biafra ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Robert Manners Osney Laboratory rjm at swift.eng.ox.ac.uk Dept of Engineering Science University of Oxford 01865 288762 Computer Museum: http://swift.eng.ox.ac.uk/rjm/museum.html Also: http://swift.eng.ox.ac.uk "The comfort you've demanded is now mandatory" - Jello Biafra ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- From rjm at swift.eng.ox.ac.uk Thu Mar 21 19:44:25 1996 From: rjm at swift.eng.ox.ac.uk (Bob Manners) Date: Thu, 21 Mar 1996 09:44:25 +0000 (GMT) Subject: UNIX for 11/23 (fwd) Message-ID: Forwarded message: Subject: Re: UNIX for 11/23 To: sms at wlv.iipo.gtegsc.com (Steven M. Schultz) Date: Thu, 21 Mar 1996 09:43:47 +0000 (GMT) In-Reply-To: <199603202239.OAA28894 at wlv.iipo.gtegsc.com> from "Steven M. Schultz" at Mar 20, 96 02:39:32 pm X-Mailer: ELM [version 2.4 PL23] Content-Type: text What about Digital's MV7 (or whatever it was called). This is mentioned in the 11/23+ owners' manual as supported. Thus it must run on the 11/23+ and support RD series disks. It is basically Bell Labs version 7 I think. > Warren's correct. MSCP support did not enter the 'BSD' picture until > late 2.9BSD or early 2.10BSD. TMSCP support for tapes didn't come > about until early 2.11BSD when I "borrowed" the driver from 4.3BSD > (who had earlier borrowed it from Ultrix). OK. I guess 2.x BSD (x>=9) requires separate I+D space? That would rule out the 11/23+ I think. > It should be noted that the MSCP (and to a greater degree TMSCP) > is a *pig* - it's the largest driver in the system, rivaling the > TTY subsystem sizewise. Yes. I can believe that. Looks like writing my own driver would be no fun at all! > An 11/23 is already extremely cramped for address space even using > simpler/smaller drivers such as the RK, RL, etc. I seriously doubt > the MSCP driver could be smashed in to a 11/23 kernel and leave room > for too much else. The 11/23+ has plenty of address space (22 bit), but mine only has 128Kw ... Cheers, Bob. -- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Robert Manners Osney Laboratory rjm at swift.eng.ox.ac.uk Dept of Engineering Science University of Oxford 01865 288762 Computer Museum: http://swift.eng.ox.ac.uk/rjm/museum.html Also: http://swift.eng.ox.ac.uk "The comfort you've demanded is now mandatory" - Jello Biafra ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- -- ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- Robert Manners Osney Laboratory rjm at swift.eng.ox.ac.uk Dept of Engineering Science University of Oxford 01865 288762 Computer Museum: http://swift.eng.ox.ac.uk/rjm/museum.html Also: http://swift.eng.ox.ac.uk "The comfort you've demanded is now mandatory" - Jello Biafra ---------------------------------------------------------------------------- From sms at wlv.iipo.gtegsc.com Fri Mar 22 02:31:20 1996 From: sms at wlv.iipo.gtegsc.com (Steven M. Schultz) Date: Thu, 21 Mar 1996 08:31:20 -0800 (PST) Subject: UNIX for 11/23 (fwd) Message-ID: <199603211631.IAA19050@wlv.iipo.gtegsc.com> Robert - > I beleive Digital's MV7 (I think) does support RDs. It is mentioned in > the 11/23+ Owners Manual. I'll have to check. I guess this version > isn't in the archive ... True - Ultrix-11 (what MV7 was called later on) does have MSCP support in it. I've not looked at how they handle the rather prodigious data space requirements (~2kb per controller) yet. Cheers. Steven