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Date: Sun, 19 Jun 88 02:46:10 EST
From: The Moderator (Mike Muuss) <Info-Unix-Request at arpa.brl>
To: INFO-UNIX at arpa.brl
Reply-To: INFO-UNIX at arpa.brl
Subject: INFO-UNIX Digest V5#073
Message-ID: <8806190246.aa22685 at SEM.BRL.ARPA>
Sender: info-unix-request at uk.ac.ucl.cs.nss
INFO-UNIX Digest Sun, 19 Jun 1988 V5#073
Today's Topics:
Re: Electronic Conferencing Systems -- Who makes 'em?
basic
Re: C/IBM
Re: QIC-xx tape standards
Re: make
Re: TeX->nroff Conversion Package
How many others use Virtual Device Interface?
-----------------------------------------------------------------
From: Rusty Hodge <rusty at hodge.uucp>
Subject: Re: Electronic Conferencing Systems -- Who makes 'em?
Date: 16 Jun 88 21:07:10 GMT
Keywords: BBS, CONFERENCING
To: info-unix at SEM.BRL.MIL
In article <15719 at sgi.SGI.COM>, hargrove at olympus.SGI.COM (Mark Hargrove) writes:
>
> I would actually appreciate the names of any vendors of Electronic
> Conferencing systems that run on *either* UNIX or VMS.
Here is the poop on People-Net (P-Net) (edited for Television):
What Is P-Net?
P-Net is the finest computer-based conferencing and electronic mail
software system available today. It operates in most Unix/Xenix
environments. Users, however, need not be aware of or have any
familiarity with the operating environment, or computers in general for
that matter, as P-Net is effectively self-contained and does not depend
on Unix from the user's perspective. Those familiar with Unix can be
allowed 'shell access' from P-Net, if desired.
P-Net is easy to operate and non-obtrusive to the communications
environment. It is fully command driven, and there is plenty of help at
any prompt or level if it is requested. Letters and messages are free-
form, with no line limits or other constraints. Wordwrap is in effect
during all composition, so it is very easy to produce clear, readable
text, while concentrating only on the thoughts you wish to get across to
a reader.
P-Net's can be networked together via phone lines with various
conference topics running in parallel on each system. That is, each
P-Net in the network would receive each other's conference messages and
post them in the proper order, maintaining topical 'threads' of
conversation. This is a very effective way to provide low cost
teleconferencing between points physically very far apart. Private
electronic mail can be directed to a user on any P-Net in the network.
Traffic can be 'queued' for immediate delivery to a target site, left
for later delivery when the phone rates are low, or routed through other
sites to the ultimate destination. P-Net can also take advantage of
other networks as its communications transport.
P-Net has been under development for over three years, being continually
tested, expanded and improved during that time. Of course, expansions
and improvements are a continuing effort based on our ideas and feedback
from current users and customers.
P-NET FUNDAMENTALS
Host Computer
P-Net software can be installed on a wide variety of Unix or Xenix
machines. Its file system is located in a secure directory structure
and is not accessible by regular Unix users. Only the system operator
(or those given security clearance) have access to any of P-Net's file
system.
Any number of public and private conversations can be created as needed.
Each conversation and topic within a conversation can be assigned a
moderator who will be in charge of that particular discussion. The
moderator has the power to add or delete participants (if the topic is
private), delete or move messages that may not be appropriate to the
current discussion, etc. A wide variety of topic types may be
configured.
A conversation may have any number of topics within it, and each topic
may have its own moderator. A topic is a division, or separate subject,
each within the domain of the conversation it is a part of. Each topic
may have any number of messages and comments.
Text is typed in by users in response, or comment, to any other message
in that topic. Or, a new thread of messages may be started. Each
message is marked with the user's name, date and time, message subject
and number. Whether that message is a comment or has comments to it is
also indicated. When read, messages and comments are displayed in the
conversation order (comments to messages are read immediately following
the original message) rather than sequentially by date (though
sequential operation is an option).
Because comments can be typed in at the user's convenience, and the
parent (original) message is always referenced, more thought can be
given to one's comments than is typical in face-to-face communication,
yet information is exchanged much more rapidly than with correspondence
using regular mail. Since the conversational thread is maintained, it
is also possible for one who has just joined the proceedings to quickly
come up to speed on the discussions thus far.
P-Net allows many individuals at a variety of locations to carry on
discussions asyncronously, that is, without having to connect to the
computer at the same time.
P-Net participants can join any topics to which they are permitted
access, to read existing messages, and enter new messages and comments.
P-Net uses its own built-in mail system for all private mail traffic.
It allows multiple recipients, Carbon-Copies, Blind-Carbon-Copies and
many other features. Incoming mail can be saved to disk (in your own
private directory), forwarded to another user or users, or replied to.
Private mail being sent can be composed online, loaded from disk, or
both. A line editor is included for editing convenience.
P-Net can communicate directly with other P-Net's or the Unix 'host'
machine on which it is running. By providing the Unix gateway, P-Net's
private mail system can exchange mail and files with other P-Net's, as
well as with the world-wide uucp-net, Usenet, and other networks which
gateway to those. It also understands pass-through traffic and site
aliasing.
Other Features
- News Items can be posted for one-time display to each account
holder when they log in.
- Users are automatically notified when new private mail has been
delivered to their mailbox.
- A 'lounge' area provides a place for real-time chatting. Ideal for
coordinated meetings when all parties needed are online at the same
time.
- Messages originating on another mail site can be delivered to an
assigned topic just as if that person posted directly.
- Private re-distribution lists can be maintained where mail sent to
a particular P-Net account will be re-sent to all recipients in a
list.
- A file utilities section allows each user access to their personal
and private file directory, and also provides uploading and
downloading of files using a variety of protocols. Users may
'attach' to other user's directory (by permission only, of course)
to share files and other information.
- Files may be 'included' in mail to another P-Net account, causing
that included file to be saved in the directory of the recipient.
- A complete database of local users is maintained on each P-Net. A
sorted list may be produced, or the list can be searched for
various criteria.
- Each user can have a 'resume' file which is displayed when
information is requested by another account holder. It is free-
form information voluntarily supplied at each account holder's
discretion.
- P-Net's command prompt changes according to which section you are
in currently, and which section(s) from which you came. This
display keeps you informed as to your 'position' within P-Net at
all times.
- Each account has a set of ID 'parameters' that tailors P-Net's
operation to the requirements of that user. Such parameters are
automatically placed into effect at log-on.
Operating System
Most versions of Unix and Xenix are supported, including BSD 4.2/4.3,
SCO Xenix 286 and 386, MicroPort System V, and AT&T System V for the 3B1
(others coming).
Storage Requirements
Anywhere from 5mb to 20mb or more depending on number of accounts,
topics, amount of traffic, etc. P-Net may be operated on a separate
mounted file system, or as part of any other mount.
Number of Users
The number of users on any given system is limited only by the number of
physical ports on the machine. It can be run as a login process, or
invoked manually from a shell.
Accounting and size control
Full account usage accounting and inactive account expiring. Topic
messages can be expired based on total topic size or number of messages.
These are all done as background processes and need little or no
intervention from the system operator.
License Types
A standard commercial single-site object code license is $2250. There
is no extra cost regardless of the number of users on that site.
Systems for which we do not currently provide object code versions of
P-Net will require a source code license at $4500.
There is a special pricing consideration of $550 for private non-
commercial uses of P-Net, such as privately owned and operated Public
BBS or Conferencing operations.
All licensing is based on a single-site usage. Special multiple-site
license pricing is available upon request.
5.2 Who To Contact For More Information
For further information or inquiries, contact Robert Williamson:
United Software Industries, Incorporated
8399 Topanga Canyon Blvd., Ste. #200
Canoga Park, CA 91304
818-887-5800
Email information and inquiries to Bill Blue:
P-Net: pnet01!bblue
ProLine:pro-sol!pnet01!bblue
UUCP: {cbosgd, hplabs!hp-sdd, ucsd, nosc}!crash!pnet01!bblue
INET: bblue at pnet01.cts.com
ARPA: crash!pnet01!bblue at nosc.mil
------------------
Sorry if that was too long. But you asked. :->
> Does anybody actually have (and use) such a system?
Yes. MouseHole is a Macintosh users group (sponsored by MacTutor
magazine) which you are welcome to call and try out. We've been
running on P-net for about 2 months now. (714) 921-2252 12/2400.
Login as 'pnet' and type 'none' for the BBS login. P-net can (of
course) also be called as a standard program from a Unix login.
Hope that helps.
--
Rusty Hodge, HCR Inc, 1588 N. Batavia St. Orange, CA 92667 (714) 974-6300
rusty at hodge.cts.com [uunet vdelta crash]!hodge!rusty FAX (714) 921-8038
-----------------------------
From: lester <lester at ka3adu.uucp>
Subject: basic
Date: 17 Jun 88 23:49:28 GMT
Keywords: basic basmark
To: info-unix at brl-sem.arpa
Is anyone running basmark basic on microport???
We just got it and am trying to get the printer and com ports to work under
it and thought someone may be able to give us some pointers.
Am trying to get a term program to run with no luck. I tried to port
PC-TALK but I get an out of memory error after about line 658 during the
compile. Aslo does anyone have some sources they could post to try out.
Thanks, bob
uunet!wa3wbu!ka3adu!lester
-----------------------------
From: Chuck_M_Grandgent at cup.portal.com
Subject: Re: C/IBM
Date: 17 Jun 88 01:39:25 GMT
XPortal-User-Id: 1.1001.3636
To: info-unix at SEM.BRL.MIL
Having been a manager presiding over a group of software development
folk used to COBOL for years, who were somewhat suddently thrown onto
a UNIX-based development platform, I'd like to throw my two cents in.
My first exposure to COBOL was 12 years ago in college. I hated COBOL
so much I flunked it the first time. However over many years I grew
to appreciate its strengths in several areas: 1) excellent file handling
capabilities, unmatched by any other language I've encountered
2) excellent self-documenting characteristics due to its English-like
verbosity. On a System-V platform, we went for Microfocus COBOL, which
I would recommend. What we DID do, was to port a couple MSDOS "C"
libraries to UNIX and then call them from the COBOL. This was seen
to be a nice situation. The libraries did handy data and date/time
conversion stuff, and would've been a pain in COBOL. The consensus
grew to be that a nice combination of "C" and COBOL got along real
well together.
-----------------------------
From: mslater at cup.portal.com
Subject: Re: QIC-xx tape standards
Date: 17 Jun 88 04:05:58 GMT
XPortal-User-Id: 1.1001.4222
To: info-unix at brl-sem.arpa
Freeman Associates in Santa Barbara was the keeper of the QIC standards,
last I checked.
-----------------------------
From: Leo de Wit <leo at philmds.uucp>
Subject: Re: make
Date: 17 Jun 88 11:16:31 GMT
To: info-unix at brl-sem.arpa
In article <16104 at brl-adm.ARPA> PAAAAAR%CALSTATE.BITNET at cunyvm.cuny.edu writes:
>I have been having a long battle with the 'make' on our 2.9BSD PDP Unix
>The documentation is dated August 1978 and most of the files haven't changed
>since 1982. The Makefile is full of commands look as if the predate UNIX as
>we know it today...
>
>Qn 1. Can anyone describe the later versions of 'make'
See the man pages. Too much to insert here. If you want copies please mail.
>Qn 2. Has anyone come up with a better way to do it?
The Sys5 make is more elaborate; the Sun make also knows of header dependencies
but still I think the standard make is quite adequate.
>Qn 3. What I need to do is keep between 10 and 20 nrofd'ed files uptodate.
[stuff deleted...]
I think your problem isn't that hard, but you shouldn't try to solve it
using make only. You have hinted to use sed yourself. What about this one:
1) Call your nroff files something like xxxxx.nrf, i.e. give them an extension.
And also for the formatted files, e.g. xxxxx.txt.
Now put in your makefile the following lines:
.SUFFIXES: .txt .nrf
.nrf.txt:
nroff -ms $< >$@; chmod 664 $@
rm -f /usr/class/$@; ln $@ /usr/class/$@
Now if you say: make week20.txt and it is not up to date, it will be made
(note the somewhat clumsy ln is needed because make expects files to reside
in the same directory for the suffix rules. You could also put the .nrf files
in the /usr/class directory).
But I assume you want to let make decide even what targets to be made?
Even this is possible: Have a first entry all in the makefile:
all:
$(MAKE) dummy `ls *.nrf|sed 's/\.nrf/.txt/'`
dummy:
The dummy entry is needed to avoid problems when there are no .nrf files
(see for yourself what happens if you omit it!).
Hope this solves your problem - like to hear about it.
>Dick Botting
>PAAAAAR at CCS.CSUSCC.CALSTATE(doc-dick)
>paaaaar at calstate.bitnet
>PAAAAAR%CALSTATE.BITNET@{depends on the phase of the moon}.EDU
>Dept Comp Sci., CSUSB, 5500 State Univ Pkway, San Bernardino CA 92407
>Disclaimer: I am an only an egg
egg: chicken
lay <$? >$@
chicken: egg
brood <$? >$@
$ make egg
Make:$! nulled; predecessor circle.
Even make doesn't know which one was older 8-).
Leo.
-----------------------------
From: Dan Trottier <dan at maccs.uucp>
Subject: Re: TeX->nroff Conversion Package
Date: 18 Jun 88 01:03:32 GMT
Followup-To: comp.unix.questions
To: info-unix at SEM.BRL.MIL
In article <11945 at mimsy.UUCP> chris at mimsy.UUCP (Chris Torek) writes:
>In article <16150 at brl-adm.ARPA> JPLILER at simtel20.arpa (John R. Pliler) writes:
>>... I am looking for a conversion package to convert TeX documents into
>>nroff format.
>
>I would say that it cannot be done, except that nroff and TeX both
>contain programming languages. Certainly it is not easy (even the
>other direction is quite difficult).
Actually it can be done and has been done. Someone at the University of
Toronto has done an excellent job. This is a sample of the README file.
Hopefully it will be available in the near future to everyone.
--- README ---
texi2roff - texinfo to troff translator
Alpha Version 1 February 1988
Copyright 1988 Beverly A. Erlebacher All Rights Reserved
Some notes on this program
--------------------------
texi2roff is a program to convert documents written using the texinfo
macro package for TeX to be printable with nroff and troff. All
texinfo commands are supported to some extent, even if by carefully
discarding them. Since texinfo allows the use of arbitrary TeX
commands provided their leading \ is converted to a @, many common
TeX commands not explicitly in texinfo are supported as well. To
see which commands are supported, and how thoroughly, examine the
table.h file. Any command whose type in the table is DISCARD will
disappear with all contained text.
[A couple of lines about updates deleted ...] I would
like to post it to comp.sources.unix and/or donate it to the GNU project
for undying fame and glory, or perhaps transient notoriety, when it is in
better shape, so please don't spread it around yet.
[So please don't send me mail asking for it! ]
[This is the amazing thing...]
Before I took this thing on a few weeks ago, I knew almost nothing about
either TeX or troff. I think some of the discarded commands could be
implemented fairly easily by someone more conversant with troff. I am
embarrassed to be hand-formatting this readme.
[More lines deleted about how to use the utility and some of the limitations
of the software. ]
--- END OF README ---
Of course it would be nice if TeX and Ditroff produced the same DVI format.
I hate having to remember which device driver is for which formatter. Maybe
Larry Wall will come out with a text formatter and we can all say goodbye
to what we currently use :-)
dan
--
A.I. - is a three toed sloth! | ...!uunet!mnetor!maccs!dan
-- Official scrabble players dictionary -- | dan at mcmaster.BITNET
-----------------------------
From: j eric townsend <erict at flatline.uucp>
Subject: How many others use Virtual Device Interface?
Date: 19 Jun 88 00:14:51 GMT
Keywords: UNIX-PC, VDI, unix, graphics
To: info-unix at SEM.BRL.MIL
I've got the Virtual Device Interface package for the 3b1 running
rel 3.0 UNIX.
What I'm wondering, is, does anybody else use this?
I'm about to start fiddling with graphics stuff on the 3b1. I'd
like to be able to ship anything I write to other people. I know
curses is the supposed standard of unix, but I don't have a full
implementation, and the stuff I'm writing will be "real" bit-map
graphics.
The package I have (claims to) support:
(among other things)
AT&T 470, 455, UNIX-PC;
CIT101, 161;
Diablo C150;
Epson MX100, 80;
HP 7470-A, 7475-A;
Okidata 92/93;
Strobe 100,200,260;
Tektronix 4105;
and VT100 with "Retro-Graphics Card (tm)".
So what's the verdict? If I write using VDI, will only UNIX-PC users
ever be able to use it, or do other UNIXes support this?
It also talks about making things "METAFONT" compatible.. What's
that? (I seem to remember seeing a Metafont book near a TeX book in the
bookstore. Any relation?)
thx in advance.
--
"It was men made her that way, Skate UNIX or go home, boogie boy...
it was us made her that way." -- from "Airhead" by Thomas Dolby
J. Eric Townsend ->uunet!nuchat!flatline!erict smail:511Parker#2,Hstn,Tx,77007
..!bellcore!tness1!/
-----------------------------
End of INFO-UNIX Digest
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